Non-Cobra Tech Question

[STL-Scott]

Okay, so I posted this in another thread...just want to see if anyone has ideas:

Front suspension on the '02 Camry is making a popping (semi-metallic, more like a loose sounding plastic jiggle) when I go over bumps, etc. Doesn't do it on smooth pavement. Coming from the drivers side front. Car also now wiggles and jiggles at speeds above 40 mph. Car has 23,000 miles on it. My mom drove it sparingly until we got it from her last fall. Age has been more of an issue with it than mileage...

Tires feel like they may be out of balance, also now pulls to the right (or left) depends on the road crown. Definently not normal. Thought I would let the dealership look at it but that may just open myself up to "get out your wallet..." This car has struts at all four wheels. Could one of the struts be bad? Wheel bearing wearing out (low mileage - not sure that makes sense). Tires out of balance and alignment. But what about the popping noise?

I've looked around under the hood to see if any plastic covers are loose or broken free (fuse relay box, air cleaner housing, etc.). Even jacked up the front drivers side and pulled the tire to rock and move the wheel and suspension to see if I can recreate the sound. Nothing.

Thoughts?

[PaulProe]

Scott,
Popping could be a loose strut or a loose link on a sway bar. It's gonna take someone pushing and pulling to try and find the loose piece. Some struts attach at the end like a shock and the nut/washer/bushing can work loose if not installed correctly. I'd start there.

Regarding the wandering, that is an alignment issue. Suspect the caster is out of spec. That could also point to a strut problem. Something has moved somewhere.

I'd take it to an alignment shop that you trust and tell them of your observations. Better get out the piggy bank. Even if you replace the struts, it's gonna get pricey.

Paul

[STL-Scott]

Thanks Paul,

How hard is it to replace struts? I've found replacement upgrades for $89/wheel at tirerack.com.

What gets me is this car is 6 years old, it's a Toyota, and only has 23k on the ODO? I thought these things lasted forever...

Haven't had a car around here aligned (moved back to STL in 2005). Anyone recommend a good shop that won't gut me for the job? What about the dealer? Have had other maintenance done at Jay Wolfe Toyota, they have a very clean shop.

BTW - Going to the FFR Build School tomorrow afternoon.

I promise to send pictures and posts each evening if I haven't passed out first (I hear the after parties are pretty good).

Cheers

[PaulProe]

Scott,
Some strut assemblies replace almost like a shock absorber - no big deal. Others get pretty complicated. All will involve removing the spring from the strut which requires special tools. I have a spring compressor you're welcome to borrow. Some special tools can also be "borrowed" from Autozone or O'Reilly's.

You might go by the local library with your library card. Their computer system has AllData manuals on them and you can lookup the process or replacing the struts on the car. It will even print out the pages of the manual.

It isn't uncommon for OEM struts to only last 25,000 miles. The manufacturers only care that they make it outside the warranty period and most owners don't notice the degradation in ride or handling when it is spread over that many miles.

I was involved in building the Wolfe dealership/shop. I don't know anyone there anymore, but hold the Wolfe organization in high regard. They are good people.

Take a look at the AllData pages in the library. I think it will help you realize the job isn't too big a task. But you will need an alignment after you're done.

Paul

[STL-Scott]

Thanks Paul.

Yeah, the struts look like the over sized version of my Koni coli-overs. Two bolts secure it to the front spindle and actually act as the upper control arm for this car. One large both is securing it in the engine bay at the top of the strut mount. Springs will need to be compressed and removed from the strut (did something similar to this a long time ago on a '69 mustang). Thanks for the reminder on renting tools from Autozone. The just swipe for credit card and if you don't return it, you bought it.

I noticed that all new car tires are the same with the tires. Even had a third party verify this. New car tires are noticeable quieter and smoother than most replacements. Why, the rubber is softer. Result - happier customers intially, tires wear out by 20k. My last four cars were all this way that had Goodyears (PT Cruiser, Honda Element, Toyota Camry, Dodge Ram). Never buy those crappy tires again.

[Kerry & Kathy]

Scott,

If the car has a front sway bar, check the frame mounting bushing for looseness and especially check the sway bar end mounting hardware to insure the hardware is tight and the end bushings are not shot.

Had a similar problem on a E350 van that was traced to badly worn sway bar bushings.

K&K

[STL-Scott]

Great advice everyone. Will check it out when I get back in town.
If you come to the FFR build school in Michigan, don't stay at the Kensington Inn.
Ask me how I know...

[Purple Venom]

Um, ok, how do you know? :rolleyes: :D

[STL-Scott]

Ya ever watch "My Name is Earl"? Imagine the place where 'Earl' and 'Randy' stay, then take away the second floor, and the hot cleaning lady (Catalina), and the functioning pool...get the picture?

[Purple Venom]

Like the Dew Drop Inn? :D

[STL-Scott]

K&K and the rest of the gang: My Camry is in the shop today getting fixed. Problem with the brakes was that the front rotors were severly warped. The disc pads are in good shape. Also, the rear brakes were not doing anything...the shop said it looked like someone got in there to do something and didn't finish the job. I believe this was the last place I took it to a few weeks ago, and when I told them I didn't want them to do the work (price was way to high) to replace the struts, they very quickly put my wheels back on and sent me on my way...so, my question is, lesson learned - don't go to this shop again, or are they cuplable for negligence? I'm not looking for anything, just don't want the next guy to have his brakes go out when a shop doesn't finish a job...

Dobbs is also replacing my strut mounting brackets and struts today. The strut mount bearings were shot, I guess this is common with Toyota's of this vintage ('02). Dobbs is a direct vendor of a 'quick strut' replacement, so they are installing this today. Another alignment will wrap it up.

So word of advice. Please don't go to Plaza Tire on Baxter at Manchester. I had asked them to look at the popping noise two months ago when I had the tires rotated/balanced and the alignment done. They ran out of time, didn't tell me they couldn't do it, and didn't look at it. When I took the car back two weeks ago to check this out, they shot me a quote of almost $1100 to just replace the struts and associated sway bar links and look at the brakes. After getting my breath back, I told them no thanks, I will take the car back without getting the work done.

I was going to do the job myself, but had many associates recommend Dobbs. Then the brake thing happended on Saturday.

Also, I had to replace the battery last night. Got home and it wouldn't restart. 6.5 years on the original battery. The positive terminal was severely corroded. Cleaned it with a base solution (warm water and baking soda), and got the connector nice and clean. Replaced the battery and it started right up. It's interesting though, with these EFI cars, when the battery is removed, the PCM loses it's memory. My repair manual said it would happen, but it has to been seen to believe it. After about 10 minutes of driving, it had relearned the mixture setting, idle speed, etc. Amazing.

And this is why I am doing the same on my Cobra build. Yes, more work in the beginning, but a much better fuel management system in the end...

I have just a few more items to do and this car should be good to go for a while. My parents never drove it, just sat in the garage. It now has 26k miles, and is 6.5 years old.

Long story I know...but thought it was worth sharing.

[Kerry & Kathy]

What you described at the house... sounded like warped rotors.

And yes...modern engine management is a sight to behold when it's working right.

And certainly worth the time to add to a "modern" Cobra.

K&K

[Matthew 10:16]

when he is around. Danny told me later that he knew what the problem was but didn't speak up cause he wasn't asked. He is very quiet. He is also EXTREMELY intelligent & knowledgeable. Give him a chance. Try him out. He is very soft spoken & will not stick his head in or offer opinions most of the time unless he is asked. He did correct me Sat. in front of Mark concerning how to do a burnout, but he only did so cause he knows I won't take offense & cause we're tight. GREAT Guy. I'm still tryn to talk him into gettn a cobra & joining our little clan.

[STL-Scott]

Thanks Dave, I will keep that in mind. I had a good idea what was wrong myself after reading up on it yesterday. I just wanted to get back home and have a shop work on it here today.

The ride home from the shop was much different, car handled crisply, no more sounds, but the breaks still feel soft. Maybe it is how they were designed. Mostly grandmas drive these cars...(i.e. my mom, and next door neighbor). I was going to bleed the brakes when I get to doing this on the roadster. Figure if it is done right it can't hurt - get the old fluid and any air in the lines out.

Took off the rear bumper cover tonight and worked out the dent in the plastic. The body work trick I found worked great. Use a heat gun on the back side, and push the plastic back into place. The material is a memory plastic. I am in the process of repainting it right now...

I just need some new wheels and tires and I am set!

Oh well, there go my cobra funds for a few months...